T10 interview about missing features
T10 interview about missing features
As well as day one DLC and such. It's mostly them defending what they have done. I no longer have high hopes for these features being patched in and rather think they built the Forza they wanted to. Bummer. The article was apparently pulled per MS request and some information removed. I didn't read it before this happened, wonder what was said?
Why are there locked cars in Free Play mode? There's no progression element to Free Play, but a player can't just play with all the cars in the game?
Having a limited Free Play garage including rentals was introduced in Forza Horizon. Our goal was to get players to form connections with the cars that mattered most to them and to feel invested in the cars they own.
What happened to the wealth of community features that made Forza so strong? It's surprising to see so much gone on a new console that's build to be community oriented. Where are clubs Storefront? Custom lobbies? Gifting of liveries and tuning?
Community is core to what we do on Forza Motorsport. In fact, it's the core part of the Franchise vision. For example, we have an even better community building system in place for creators with a curated content system that automatically serves players the best curated paints and tunes in the game. Gone are the days of managing your Storefront inventory. In the last generation most of our painters put up their works of art for free because they wanted the notoriety. Now, our best creators are paid in-game and recognized based on the usage of their creations, rather than number of downloads or market value. At the same time, drivers get this amazing UGC and don't have to pay anything for it. In all, it's a much better system for both parties.
Regarding car clubs, the new UI system in Forza Motorsport 5 means everything gets rebuilt. Being on the Xbox One gives us the opportunity to rethink old problems. The original Forza Motorsport featured Car Clubs, but Forza Motorsport 2 on the Xbox 360 didn't. For that matter, car clubs weren't in Forza Motorsport 3 either.
Finally, in addition to racing in a variety of preset lobbies, players can still create custom lobbies to race in with their friends.
What is the expectation for someone who wants to "play" their way to the top? Even with Drivatars I see players reporting between 5-30K in daily earnings. To be able to buy the top cars, or even just a single top car, at that rate would take a very long time. Even factoring in a lot of daily racing. Furthermore, credit earning does not seem to scale and ramp up with leveling.
The expectation is that different cars are more expensive and that makes them more rare. Because of the classification system, there is no "top" to the production classes. Currently, we have some players earning lots of credits and some players earning not nearly as much. This is a skill- and strategy-based economy with rarity provided by in-game price, not locking mechanisms. Players can receive +65% payout for playing against the hardest skill level Drivatars, up to +50% bonus credit payouts for turning off the assists, and up to +35% payouts for sticking with a favorite manufacturer. That's +150% bonus based on skill and strategy. When you couple that with Drivatar rewards, UGC payouts, and Forza Rewards (our franchise-based loyalty rewards) there are plenty of ways to earn credits in Forza 5. However, the fact remains: racing, skill, and strategy are the engine of the economy. Of course, we continue to monitor the economy via customer feedback as well as in-game telemetry and we have the ability to make adjustments should it be warranted.
What happened to the beloved Green Monster?
I assume you mean the Green Hell, aka the Nürburgring (and not Fenway Park!) When we built the tracks in Forza Motorsport 5, we had a set ourselves an extremely high quality bar. With a brand new graphics engine created specifically for Xbox One, we wanted to take advantage of light and atmosphere and there was no better way to show that off than the tracks themselves. As a result, for the tracks in Forza 5, we started from scratch. That meant going back to the beginning and capturing them in a way that would correct inaccuracies from the previous generation, updating tracks where warranted (such as the new layout for Silverstone), and using state-of-the-art techniques to bring these tracks to Xbox One. That included the use of laser-scanning technology, which allowed us to capture tracks with pinpoint accuracy. Tracks like Spa-Francorchamps and Bathurst – two of the most heavily requested tracks from the Forza community – are in Forza 5 and brought to life in stunning detail. Even tracks like Laguna Seca – a circuit that has been in the Forza series since the original game – have benefited from this approach. Forza Motorsport 5 players expect the cars and tracks in the game to be built to the highest detail and realism – anything less wouldn't be Forza. For that reason, we didn't put in old low res content just to pad our numbers. Expect more news on tracks in Forza Motorsport 5 in the near future.
With it being a flagship title for the new console, already a lot of cash to lay out for gamers, and not the largest garage of cars, why is there day one DLC? Why couldn't those cars have been part of the core game if they are ready at launch?
First, some context: As you know, Forza Motorsport 2 shipped a year and a half after the launch of the Xbox 360. It featured 270 cars (200 base models plus 35 race car liveries as well as 35 aftermarket tuner body kits) without cockpits and just 12 environments. This was less environments than the original Forza Motorsport, as all of the environments had to be rebuilt for the bespoke new generation engine. By comparison, Gran Turismo 3 A-Spec (the first GT game on PlayStation 2, and not a launch title, by the way) shipped with 150 cars and far fewer tracks.
Obviously, we did not cut anything from Forza Motorsport 5, as we had to build it all from the ground up. All 35+ gigs of it. We started the game a year before Forza 4 shipped in order to give us the time to build the game we wanted to build, and to define racing for the new generation. We have a new UI system, we have new materials and lighting that stress the imperfect details of the world running at 60fps and 1080p. There are the new physics and AI innovations - features not possible on last generation hardware. Of course, now taking advantage of next gen hardware, the tracks require more resolution, detail and materials – this is simply the cost of moving to a new generation for any team wanting to push. In addition, we have Forzavista for every car. This is what allowed us to do the close-up pre- and post-race cinematics and high-resolution cockpits, as well as the reflective cockpit glass. We were able to use the added console power to make cockpit view more immersive and more drivable than last generation. We've already seen from player data that the number of people that are playing the game from cockpit view (as the primary view) has greatly increased from Forza Motorsport 4 - that is the result of the same investment they gave us Forzavista.
Here's the context that is probably most surprising; Forza Motorsport 5 is actually the largest racing game ever delivered at the launch of a console, by a long shot. In fact, it would be huge even by second holiday standards. As mentioned above, it is bigger than Forza 2, which was delivered a year and half after the launch of the Xbox 360. It also has more car diversity than any previous Forza Motorsport; by including open wheel race cars and track toys like the KTM X-Bow and the Ariel Atom on top of the diversity that took us years to build up across multiple iterations on the Xbox 360. Moreover, we've defined an uncompromised quality bar for new generation racing games in both car and track detail and immersion - all while, delivering unprecedented size.
Regarding DLC, we have found that 10 cars a month is the fastest we could create “just in time” content. Just like in Forza Motorsport 4, we are planning to add as many as 10 cars a month to Forza Motorsport 5. It takes more than six months to build every car. Delivering cars in monthly packs allows us to keep the game new and fresh for those that are interested.
BULLSHIT, what he should have said is gimmie your fucking money
Dan sure would make a good politician.
I think Gizzie got it about right. Wonder how well Dan kept a straight face bullshitting his way through these questions. I'll give him this...the guy is good in regards to marketing/spin.
Turn10 seems in denial to me. This game defintiely does not cater to the likes of us and hasn't since FM2 maybe into FM3 when they converted to a car lovers game so the majority of us have lost interest. And I can't see how car lovers will have the desire to put in the time it will take to open up the majority of the cars so the car lovers can enjoy them. Thankfully Turn10 provided tokens for us so we could get the cars we want by paying rediculous amounts of real money...as Craig put it so well in another thread yesterday "obviously Turn10 expanded on the pay to play format"
Was going to add to the discussion (beat down) on the FM forums yesterday which had me going back to the WIR a couple weeks back where Mechberg spent paragraphs talking about the new economy system and how great and fair and everything that people have been looking for. In there he said and I quote..."Tokens were added to Forza 4 and Forza Horizon based on feedback from a small number of our players who wanted the ability to jump straight into any car in the game without having to earn the credits through normal racing." Since when does a company like Turn10 make drastic design game changes based on a "small" number of players feedback? That's a rhetorical question as the answer is "When it allows us to scrounge more money from the consumer."
In the same WIR and along the subject of increased tokens to purchase cars Mechberg wrote..."For those who want to spend some extra real money and get those exclusive cars, they’ll have that option, but they will no longer devalue the hard work of those who earned the cars through racing and building up in-game credits. Either way, expensive cars will have real rarity." Whether you agree with the statement that purchased cars "devalue" the hard work of those who earned it is irrelevant (I dont believe it btw). The fact of the matter is if you believe me purchasing a Lotus F1 for $2.00 worth of real money devalues the hard work of those who earned it then the same MUST be true if I spend $50.00 of real money for the same car. Hence this "devalue" argument is a crock of shit.
Parcells fully expected a lack lustre FM5 but even I'm surprised at the level of missing features and really how they screwed over the car lovers having screwed over the SIM racers just a few years back.
So a few people request tokens be added to the mix and voila we have tokens but how many years have we been asking for aero to be fixed in the pits...almost everyone for 5+ years but they still didn't fix this..this is clearly not a game created for SIM racers.
After playing for the past week I think I might scratch T10 products off future purchases. The game looks amazing and I am enjoying it but after I had read that article the other night over at FM.net I just can't see me buying anymore of their stuff.
BTW that is not the original article. It was posted and people started finding out about it MS asked for it to be taken down. Suddenely it showed back up and from what a few have said it was changed. So apparently there was some comments made that rubbed MS the wrong way.
How do you call a game a car lovers game and then take away the ability to enjoy it. I like the idea of the leagues, I am enjoying those more than I ever did in Forza4. Why though make it so someone can't enjoy all the cars? After playing since release I made 300k. Well I bought a car to race in a different league after I finished the first one, because you no longer are awarded any cars. That cost about 40k. Then of course buying the parts to tune the car was another 32k. So now I'm back down to just over 200k and I would really love to get the Lotus F1 someday. At this point I am afriad to try new cars because well I have to save those credits for other cars for future leagues.
I have other games on the X1 so I don't think I will be getting to the Lotus F1 for a while, since I play other games and have a life outside of Forza. Reading that article was a slap in the face to me. We don't want to give you access to everything so quick because we want you to value your imaginary car more is basically how I read it.
Forza was one of the deciding factors on me getting the X1. Luckily though I have found some other games that are making me happy I bought the xbox.
Am I the only one enjoying FM5?
The drive is absolutely sublime (have been using this word too frequently these days).
No complaints about credits but you do have to turn off the assists and turn up the difficulty to get the credit boost at every race.
Plus, Rivals gives you lots of credits at high end. You can take your first free C500 car and go through all of the C class rivals!
So far, only really used 2 C500 cars on regular basis to collect credits (MX-5 & Fiesta ST).
GRD, I do enjoy the game. The visuals are great. The rumble triggers are actually pretty nice and I like the whole autovista. Multiplayer in regards to groups of people trying to organize events is where I start getting upset.
And why the grind? With no auction house so what if someone gets a 100k, 500k, or hell even a million after a race. Forza has been about driving the cars that you can't in real life and racing them. Now we can't even drive them in the game unless you focus on racing and saving for a certain car. I would love to get the Lotus F1 and run it but thats gonna be a long way down the road.
So although I am enjoying the game. I also have some issues with how they decided to make it so that an imaginary car somehow has value to me. I didn't buy the game to develope a relationship with my pixel Ford Fiesta.
Btw no hard feelings towards you GRD and I hope you don't take this as directed towards you. Just really feeling let down by T10 and the interview was like a punch in the dick.
No problem! Everyone has their own way of playing/enjoying these things. Sorry to hear that it feels like a PITD; I'm just feeling something entirely different on my dick . . .
Yeah, I also am disappointed.
All versions of Forza allowed you to play the game a little differently depending on what you liked to do. With each new version they made the franchise even more tailored to the many things people like to do with cars aside from just racing.
You could race vs the game AI, race vs your friends, race (hotlap) against your times, race (hotlap) against the worlds times, hotlap against a community for a prize, paint cars, design logos, build many versions of one car (both mechanically and tuning), drift, drag,be part of a club, buy and sell cars, tunes, liveries, etc, etc.
The whole Forza brand let you experience the game the way YOU wanted. It could be played 100 different ways!!!!
Now, throw that all away. Now you must do it our way AND pay more money for it.
We are left with a 1st gen Arcade racer with so many options removed or put out of reach high enough that we can no longer play it our way. We must play it their way before we can have our specific fun. :(
Yes, I can still hotlap which is my one true love in the game. I loved buying cars (lots of cars), building them and tuning them and running laps. Rinse and repeat. Well, now that ability has crippled me since I now must really think about what to buy as far as a car and then when buying parts, I reallllly need to be careful, but will still end up speding a ton just to get it right. Normally that wouldn't be a problem since I could re-sell the car and/or parts for 50% off to reinvest in the next car. I find myself now looking at the LBs and immediately agreeing on picking up a car that is in the top 100 or so just to make sure I don't wast any credits on a car that can never compete against the 'top cars' in the class. I used to love trying, but that is not it anymore. I have to wonder how many gems will remain un-noticed for a very long time solely because we have to really budget ourselves.
I have to laugh when I read people asking how many cars their garage can hold.... at this rate it will be a year before anyone is near any limit.
From a builder/tuner/hotlapper, this reallllllllly sucks. But I think because I love hotlapping, the 'grind' for me is different. I always grind, but this time, it will be in the same freaking cars for a while. Sucks.
I still will play but it won't be nearly as fun for me as it could have been.
Anyway............................ that felt good to type.
cheers!
:D