Something weird with the El Camino
#1
Wed, 12/04/2013 - 01:54
Something weird with the El Camino
I can't get it to go above 200mph. Does Forza 5 now take aerodynamic limitations into account? I gave it nearly 1,000 hp and no aero, should be able to go a lot faster than 200. No, was not bouncing off the rev limiter, there was still about 2.5k rpms left in the final gear. Strange.
Hmm, I know for fact a 76 big block 454/automatic transmission El Camino will run 165 at just over 2000 rpms down the highway , let's say, in Homestead?
It will go faster, however there was a Trooper to avoid and disgression being the better part of...well you know, we decided to get off the highway before we were formally asked to.
do you have any braking assists on? seems like that keeps your max speed down.
If braking assist is on AND the driving/braking line is red, that may be the issue, but I'm guessing fjosh has been around Forza long enough to know that, and I highly doubt he's running any assists at all. I could be wrong as he's so horribly slow...not!.gif "22")
If the aerodynamics were accurate, the rear end would lift from the air passing over the cab creating a vacuum over the "bed" as it passed over the rest of the car.
No, auto braking is not turned on. Observe, all clips are the same racing V8 engine swap, all with no aero. You would think that with the same motor and gearing that the El Camino would have a higher top end than the Jeep, right? You would also think that with an extra 170 horsepower the same car would gain more than a couple miles per hour, right?
This clip is the El Camino with 825 horsepower
http://youtu.be/9R_bBnDcTwg
This clip is the El Camino with 994 horsepower
http://youtu.be/UZkjZ1ADWqE
This clip is one of the least aerodynamic vehicles in the game, the brick on wheels that is the Jeep SRT8 with 994 horsepower
http://youtu.be/TUuJUpnDyAc
Looking at the first 2 vids i would guess the higher horsepower car is actually struggling to put its power down effectively, keeping in mind that the straight at Le Mans has a very bumpy surface it's certainly a possibility. Adding some rear tire width or tuning adjustments to keep better road contact could help with that.
Both the El Camino and Jeep are setup with race tires, widest width available, and stiffer front suspension than rear. With that mentioned, I still came to this possibilty and wondered if rear aero would help but adding rear aero, at any tuning setting, results in lower top end. Though it does stick to the ground much better and does less floating back and forth in the road.
I don't know if you can pull up the telemetry with traction circles as in forza 4, but if you can look at that & if the size of the circles jumps up & down violently try messing with your damper settings, that will probably have more effect than just softening the rear springs.
I'll give it a try tonight after work, for sure.
I think I left my El Camino in D class and there's very little danger of it reaching 200mph. Even in Forza 4, my A-Class El Camino maxed out around 170 mph. The Jeep sounds like a good candidate for nerfing, like they dd in Forza4 wit the Z28.
After running the Kia cee'd in the BTCC series,
The power shown in telemetry is the power developed by the engine, but not necessarily the power delivered to the wheel. I am thinking there is quite a significant power loss in transmission "coded" into the calculations. While Kia had same 350HP as Honda, Kia just just cannot match Civic's speed.
The old cars tend to have more transmission power loss coded into the calculations so the power you see on screen is correct but at the same time misleading.
Jeep SRT, while being a big brick is not carrying an empty tub behind it and I would guess its coefficient of drag at about 0.40 at the worst while El Camino would be about 0.35. El Camino also has smaller frontal area therefore all things being equal El Camino should be much much faster.
Only way to explain the difference is POWER (flywheel) - POWER (wheel) = POWER (lost) is greater in El Camino than in the Jeep SRT.
"El Camino Central" has a thread on this and it suggests using 0.35 for the drag coefficient and 20~25% for the TRANSMISSION LOSS. I think that's your answer there.
All clips are with the racing tranny, race driveshaft, and race diff swap so any loss of power due to the drivetrain should be equal, right?
Also does not explain why an extra 170 horsepower makes the exact same car and build go from 194/195 up only a couple miles per hour.
Give any other car in the game (that I've tried so far, even the Jeep) 1,000 hp and the gearing to do so and it will go faster than 204/205.
You are speaking logic! But there is no way for us to know how T10 has coded the power delivery.
Does the coding/programming reduce the transmission loss reduced when gear/shaft/differential etc. are upgraded? I think this requires a test set-up:
1. Run El Camino with stock transmission, driveshaft, and diff > run at 100mph then note the power.
2. Run El Camino with race transimission, driveshaft, and diff > run at 100mph then note the power.
IF, the difference in transmission loss is taken into calculations, then the power should be different (I am guessing > than 10% difference).
IF, the difference in transmission loss is NOT taken into calculations, then the power should be about the same.
I am liking this mystery.